Index ← 1645 CFJ 1646 1647 → text
==============================  CFJ 1646  ==============================

    Quazie's VC spending in the message identified by message ID
    <> took effect in the Agoran week
    beginning at 00:00 UTC on 30 April 2007.


Caller:                                 Zefram

Judge:                                  Taral
Judgement:                              TRUE



Called by Zefram:                       30 Apr 2007 00:39:20 GMT
Assigned to Taral:                      04 May 2007 20:21:22 GMT
Judged TRUE by Taral:                   18 May 2007 22:44:34 GMT


Caller's Arguments:

Game custom is not entirely decided on when a message is effective.
A couple of rules have in the past referred explicitly to the "Date:"
header, but this was generally regarded as a bug, because that header can
be arbitrarily wrong.  We have the common practice of using the "Date:"
in cases where it is reasonably correct and the precise timing is not
significant, but there is also explicit precedence for ignoring the
"Date:" header entirely where it is manifestly wrong.

We've previously had the standard (I'm not sure how formal) that a message
was effective when it left the player's domain of technical control.
This can generally be judged by the first Received: header added (which
is the one that appears last in the message).  Another possible standard
would be when the message reaches the PF (the first Received: header added
by the listserver), and another would be when the message was sent to the
listserver's output (the last Received: header added by the listserver).
In this case, these three standards give times of 00:00:06, 00:00:07,
and 00:01:04 UTC, assuming that all clocks are accurate.  Each of these
times is rounded down to the next second, so actually that 00:00:06 means
"anywhere between 00:00:06 inclusive and 00:00:07 exclusive".

I note that varying rules on the PF mean that judgements and game custom
on this issue from particular periods of the game are not necessarily
applicable now.


Caller's Evidence:

these are the headers from Quazie's message that contain dates,
up to the last one added by the PF listserver:

> >Received: from (localhost [])
> >     by (Postfix) with ESMTP
> >     id 3AF5A8067E; Sun, 29 Apr 2007 19:01:04 -0500 (CDT)
> >Received: from (
> >     by (Postfix) with ESMTP id 785CC80680
> >     for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2007 19:00:07 -0500
> >Received: by with SMTP id f31so1255755pyh
> >        for ; Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:00:07
-0700 (PDT)
> >Received: by with SMTP id c1mr10221091pyl.1177891206799;
> >        Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:00:06 -0700 (PDT)
> >Received: from Quazies-FUNK-O-TRON.local ( [])
> >        by with ESMTP id u2sm11376690pyb.2007.;
> >        Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:00:06 -0700 (PDT)
> >Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2007 19:59:57 -0400


Judge Taral's Arguments:

Rule 683 states: An eligible voter on a particular Agoran decision
submits a ballot to the vote collector by publishing a valid notice
indicating which one of the available options e selects.

Rule 478 states: A player "publishes" or "announces" something by
sending a public message.

It is a fact that, with current computer email programs, the act of
"sending" takes a certain amount of time; namely, the duration of the
initiating SMTP transaction. This is marked by the Received: header --
2007/04/30 00:00:06 GMT according to the posted emails.

In the interest of fairness, unavoidable delays, i.e. those outside of
the normal control of the player, cannot be considered in the
determination of the time of sending. Similarly, avoidable delays
should necessarily be included in the duration of the act of sending.
There is analogy with real life: a letter is not sent when one
encloses it in the envelope; it is sent when one places it in the
mailbox and it therefore leaves one's person. Indeed, to decide
otherwise would permit players to arbitrarily backdate announcements
and announced actions, which would be notably against the good of the
game (perhaps not the spirit, though *grin*).